This is amazing. I just opened a very colorful image in CM and applied a fair amount of saturation to it. Then I took the image into PS, duplicated it, and turned off the CM layer. Then I applied saturation from the Hue/Sat slider to match the CM adjusted image. The Noise from Hue/Sat was tremendous. The noise from CM non-existent.
I went back into CM, and as I raise the Saturation, the noise disappears, as I lower it, it becomes more obvious.
What kind of magic is this?
...true, I kind of blasted out some detail, but that's beside the cool point.
Gloria
HSB and no noise. At all.
I can't say what happened for sure without seeing the image, but that's never stopped me before.
It's not unusual that when you want to bump saturation, you want to do so in the colors that are less intense, and leave the ones that are already there alone. In Curvemeister you can do this by moving the middle of the saturation curve upward, leaving the white end of same curve in place. This protects the already intenst colors from becoming blowing out, and at the same time adds more oomph to the medium colors.
OTOH, in Photoshop's Hue/Sat you have basically one slider to move, sort of like using contrast instead of curves or even levels. Moving it will increase the color intensity (and the noise) of the more colorful areas.
Of course, if I saw the actual image, it could be something else entirely. :-)
On a related note. Dan Margulis has said a couple of times that one of the great uses of masking is to allow saturation to be increased selectively in bright areas, leaving dark areas alone.
To tell the truth, I haven't tried this yet. Here's what Dan said, a few days ago discussing CM's new masking:
"It adds a lot of power to intensify color. I've realized in the last few years that we look for intense colors in the quartertone range, more intense than the camera ever provides. We can use LAB or similar to help get there, but the problem is that it can make the darker areas too saturated. We'll see how far they carry the ball." - DM
I would add that they is ... us! :-)
It's not unusual that when you want to bump saturation, you want to do so in the colors that are less intense, and leave the ones that are already there alone. In Curvemeister you can do this by moving the middle of the saturation curve upward, leaving the white end of same curve in place. This protects the already intenst colors from becoming blowing out, and at the same time adds more oomph to the medium colors.
OTOH, in Photoshop's Hue/Sat you have basically one slider to move, sort of like using contrast instead of curves or even levels. Moving it will increase the color intensity (and the noise) of the more colorful areas.
Of course, if I saw the actual image, it could be something else entirely. :-)
On a related note. Dan Margulis has said a couple of times that one of the great uses of masking is to allow saturation to be increased selectively in bright areas, leaving dark areas alone.
To tell the truth, I haven't tried this yet. Here's what Dan said, a few days ago discussing CM's new masking:
"It adds a lot of power to intensify color. I've realized in the last few years that we look for intense colors in the quartertone range, more intense than the camera ever provides. We can use LAB or similar to help get there, but the problem is that it can make the darker areas too saturated. We'll see how far they carry the ball." - DM
I would add that they is ... us! :-)
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mikemeister_admin
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mikemeister_admin
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I just got back to this, and haven't quite figured it out yet. I have to go find some good noisy images on another hard drive. But I am posting the two close up sections. Here is all I did. I moved the saturation curve in CM in the middle of the curve from 45 to 65. I could see the noise smooth out. It looks like I applied a filter of some kind.
I used a hue/sat layer in PS for the second example. I think it was about 20 points, but I just looked at the CM version and tried to match it. Huge noise increase; broke apart completely in some areas. The CM file (Mikedoesntbelieveit1) is with this post. The PS file (Mikedoesntbelieveit2) is posted separately.
As far as the Wiki article, Greg, if this turns out to be consistent and explainable, sure I'll describe and send you some examples. :) (Yep, don't like writing on the Wiki site.)
I used a hue/sat layer in PS for the second example. I think it was about 20 points, but I just looked at the CM version and tried to match it. Huge noise increase; broke apart completely in some areas. The CM file (Mikedoesntbelieveit1) is with this post. The PS file (Mikedoesntbelieveit2) is posted separately.
As far as the Wiki article, Greg, if this turns out to be consistent and explainable, sure I'll describe and send you some examples. :) (Yep, don't like writing on the Wiki site.)
Something interesting is definitely happening here. I'll need a little time to think about this, but one thing I noticed, in Photoshop, is that the Brightness of the star shaped noise area changes significantly with the saturaiton adjustment. It seems to me that an HSB or HSL saturation adjustment would change only the saturation.
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mikemeister_admin
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Gloria, there's a nagging thought in the back of my mind saying that somewhere I read that PS H/S adjustment layers increase noise more so than a&b channel adjustments. IIRC, it was something about H/S creating haloing.
It's not unusual that when you want to bump saturation, you want to do so in the colors that are less intense, and leave the ones that are already there alone. In Curvemeister you can do this by moving the middle of the saturation curve upward, leaving the white end of same curve in place. This protects the already intense colors from becoming blowing out, and at the same time adds more oomph to the medium colors.
This is really intriguing.
It's not unusual that when you want to bump saturation, you want to do so in the colors that are less intense, and leave the ones that are already there alone. In Curvemeister you can do this by moving the middle of the saturation curve upward, leaving the white end of same curve in place. This protects the already intense colors from becoming blowing out, and at the same time adds more oomph to the medium colors.
This is really intriguing.
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